投资、创业、人生？资深金融男给你上堂课

作 者｜BingChan

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中文共5280字

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本期嘉宾：Dean McClelland，资深金融行业投资人，深耕投资领域二十余年，曾在PayCorp，Oppenberg Capital等多家金融机构工作，现任Tontine Trust唐提信托创始人。

唐提信托的非凡之处在于每年，他都会让上百万达到退休年龄的用户的生活水准得以提高。当然，如果更想了解这个项目，文末有传送门，诸君可以自己了解。

这次访谈

我们主要来和这位资深金融男

聊了聊投资 创业和人生

访谈记录

Dean

Bing chan

1

区块链投资 哪里最有潜力？

Bingchan: Dean，我知道您最近在亚洲和世界其他很多地方奔波；那么，走过了这么多地方，那么对于区块链项目投资来讲，您觉得最有潜力的地方是哪里？

Bingchan: Hi, Dean, I know you have traveled around many places in Asia and other places worldwide recently, and as far as you are concerned, what is the most potential place for blockchain investment?

Dean:我之所以在亚洲呆了如此长的时间，是因为我看到了亚洲市场在提供问题解决方案这一点上具备巨大的潜力。在欧洲或是在美国，你看到的是他们花了几百年时间实现的商业成果，这些商业成果已经成功应用到了市场的方方面面。

Dean: The reason I am spending so much of my time in Asia these days is that I see amazing potential to adopt new technologies to solve problems. In Europe & the US you have all these massive established industries that have spent hundreds of years building up their businesses and in many ways they have crowded every corner of their markets.

而在亚洲，我们看到的是巨大且不断快速发展的人口以及源源不断累积的财富；现在亚洲市场面临的问题是发达经济体30年前所面临的问题，而亚洲市场正在寻求这些问题的解决方案。

In Asia though we have enormous, fast growing populations that are becoming more and more wealthy and that are now seeking to solve the same problems that developed economies solved 30 years ago.

但是现在一个巨大的不同点就是亚洲并不是在复制30年前的解决方案，它做的是开拓更加创新且更能解决实际问题的方法，让新方法超越老技术。

The big difference though is that Asia is not trying to replicate the 30 year old solutions, they are looking at how to make better, more modern solutions that “leapfrog” the old technologies.

一个简单的例子就是在美国/欧洲，很多家庭在家里还摆着铜制的电话线或者网线，然而在亚洲，基本上所有人只用手机进行日常沟通。

A simple example of leapfrogging is that in US/Europe, most homes have a copper cable running to their homes for phone / internet connection but in many parts of Asia everyone just uses their mobile.

另一个经典案例就是微信支付和支付宝支付。有了这些便利的服务，谁还需要银行卡?

Another good example is WeChatPay and Alipay. Who needs a bank account anymore if you have these?

我认为相似的潮流会发生在区块链身上，人们日常可以使用区块链支付及区块链转账服务。

I think we will see something similar with blockchain where blockchain based payments solutions and remittance solutions will take over whole areas of economies.

接下来区块链就会涉足保险领域。当人们的财富日趋增长之时，他们也会开始研究如何让自己免于财务纠纷；人们不会纠结于无用的财务解决方案，他们想要的是最简单，最值得信任的解决方案，让金钱得以实现最大的价值。

Next after that will be insurance. When people start gaining more wealth, they also start thinking about how to protect themselves from financial problems and there is no reason why people will look to old inefficient solutions that do not meet their needs. They will want the simplest most trustworthy solutions that offer the best value for money.

2

唐提信托：越长寿，收益越高？

Bingchan：您能否告诉我们一些关于唐提信托项目的细节（收益及风险）以及您做这个项目的动机是什么？举例来讲，我们知道您的目标是“越长寿，收益越高”，而我们的读者也想知道一些基本信息以及投资者是如何从中收益的。

Dean: 找个你认识的已退休人士，问问他们每个月花多少钱才不会入不敷出。事实是他们并不清楚这些，所以他们在退休之后会担忧他们花费几何，这实际上非常糟糕。

Dean: Talk to anyone you know that has retired and ask them how they know how much money they can spend every month without running out of money. The fact is that they cannot know and therefore they spend their retirements worrying whether they are spending too much or too little. That is an awful way to live in retirement.

近十年来，全球学者们建议引入史上最为流行的金融产品来解决这一问题，同时建立了一种全新的可以自动购买人寿保险的养老金代替方案。这个系统就被称为唐提，我们设计了这个系统并且申请了专利，该产品就是以区块链技术为依托的唐提，因为精密的数学运算作为后盾，他们可以保证投保人的收入平衡。

For the last 10 years at least, academics around the world have suggested bringing back the most popular financial product in history to solve this problem and to create a whole new alternative type of pension system that automatically provides longevity insurance. This is called a Tontine and we have designed and filed a patent for a blockchain based Tontine that is mathematically guaranteed against ever running out of money.

基本来讲，现在人们可以存款并且为退休之后的生活投资，他们会收到人生中的一笔收入，而这笔钱财永远不会流失。更好的是月度收益的增长，投保人越长寿，月度收益保持增长，而年级越大的投保人则是中了乐透彩的幸运儿！

So basically now people can save and invest for retirement knowing for certain that they will receive an income for life that will never run out of money. Even better is that the monthly payments more or less increase slightly on a monthly basis such that if the member lives a very long time then monthly payments should just keep increasing and the elderly member will probably feel a little bit like a lottery winner.

这也是为家庭成员解决压力的方案。如果你已婚，承担着赡养四位长辈的责任，现在你承担着加倍的压力-因为父母越长寿，他们的存款就会消耗的越快。

This is also a great solutions for taking pressure off of families. If you are a married couple with responsibility for taking care of 4 retired parents then you now have the added stress that the longer your parents live, the more likely that their savings will run out.

但是如果你的父母投资了唐提，那么不用担心，你只需要好好照顾你他们，这样一来只要他们身体健康，那么这项收入就会一路看涨。

But if your 4 parents invest into a Tontine then you have no need to worry, you just need to take care of your parents as best you can knowing that the total family income is likely to keep increasing for as long as you are blessed to have your parents around.

在金融机构涉足且唐提社区币付诸市场之前，这是事情运作的雏形。

In many ways this is how everything used to work all over the world before financial institutions stepped in and pushed community based tontines out of the market.

3

豪华而专业的顾问团队

（顾问团队包括比特币基金会创始董事，曼联董事会成，前高盛高级咨询师……等等，是不是很厉害的阵容！）

Bingchan:您的顾问团队阵容强大，包括Jon Matonis（比特币基金会的创始董事），Michael Edelson（曼联董事会成员），数字货币经济学家Jorg Platzer及前高盛亚太区资深咨询师Norbert Gehrke。他们是否是项目的投资者？还有一个小问题就是您是否是曼联的粉丝？

Bingchan: You have a very powerful consulting team, including Jon Matonis, Michael (Mike) Edelson, Jorg Platzer and Norbert Gehrke. Are they investors for your project？And one quick question is that are you a fans of Manchester United?

Dean: Jon在2011年成立比特币基金会；在那之前我们就已经是彼此的挚友；我跟Mike在合作了一些IPO项目后，就成了好友，现在已经20多年了。

Dean: I have known & trusted Jon since before he set up the Bitcoin Foundation in 2011 and have known Mike for around 20 years as we collaborated on some amazing tech IPOs.

去年，我跟Joerg在柏林著名的77比特币吧见了一面；多年以来，他一直和Jon讲想把区块链技术和唐提项目相融合；在柏林之旅中，更是万幸可以和Norbert相见，他为我们介绍了金融科技领域一些非常著名的玩家。

所有这些顾问，或者购买了TON币，或者介绍了买家，或者两者兼而有之。

我从1994年开始就支持曼联，我觉得这样一来，跟Mike合作更有意思；Mike在过去的30年间一直是曼联的董事会成员。

All of the advisors have either bought TON$ personally or introduced buyers or both.

I have supported Manchester United since 1994 which makes it even more enjoyable to work with Mike whom has been a director of Manchester United for the last 30 years.

去年，我和Mike吃午饭并且阐释了我所工作的项目，他告诉我他的父亲60年前就是唐提的一员，而唐提在很多情况下，帮助Mike和家人渡过了二战之后的财政危机。因为这个原因，Mike很乐意帮助我们把唐提构建成一个全球性的平台，帮助上百万的家庭。可以想象，一旦我们准备充分，Mike将会帮助我们找到退休的足球运动员来投资我们的项目，他们就可以一劳永逸，不用担心财产损失了。

I was having lunch with Mike last year explaining what I was working on when he told me that his father had been a member of a Tontine about 60 years ago and that the Tontine had on many occasions helped Mike’s family survive during the financial depression after World War 2. For this reason, Mike is very excited to help us grow Tontine into a global platform that can help hundreds of millions of families worldwide. I can also imagine that once we are ready, Mike will be able to help us get some retired footballers investing into our Tontines to ensure they never run out of money in their old age.

4

唐提信托=饥饿游戏？

（这个炫酷的海报有点厉害）

Bingchan:为什么您称唐提信托为饥饿游戏？

Bingchan: Why do you call Tontine Trust “The Hunger Games” of Pensions?

Dean:去年我和Jon Forman教授通了一次电话，他是一位著名的美国学者，曾经写过几篇关于唐提的重要文章并且阐释过为什么我们把能够一次性持有Tontine的人数限制在10, 000人以内。

Dean: I was on a call last year with Professor Jon Forman, a famous US academic that has written some important papers about Tontines and was trying to explain why we limit our Tontines to 10,000 members at a time.

我们的想法是为成员提供激励，让他们注重身体健康，努力生活让自己成为长寿人群中的一份子，这也意味着他们会在漫漫人生路中得到更多财政激励。

The idea is to provide a motivation for the members to try to take better care of their health and to try to be the last surviving member which means that they will have benefited the most financially during their lifetime.

这次我们想做的就是养老金中的“饥饿游戏”；虽然在最近几个月，我听到越来越多的人把我们比作“大逃杀”，甚至是“堡垒之夜”。不过我认为这始终是积极向上的游戏激励，因为在唐提中，我们的系统并不旨在对其他成员进行杀戮，而是让你关注自己的健康状况，是非常积极的！

The best way we could describe it at the time was “The Hunger Games” of Pensions although in recent months I am hearing more and more people compare us to the Battle Royale or even the Fortnite of pensions. I think this is a fair comparison of the life-affirming “game mechanics” motivation which being in a tontine creates although in our system winning comes not from killing off the other members but rather from outliving the other members by taking better care of your health.

5

老手给新手的投资建议，必看！

Bingchan:作为资深投资者，您对我这样的新手投资者有没有什么建议？

Bingchan: As an investor with profound experiences, do you have some suggestions for rookie investors like me?

Dean:这是个十分重要的问题，我投资科技创业公司已经20年了，所有在这些年，我循序渐进，学了很多。因为从年轻时代开始深耕，现在积累了丰厚的经验。

很多科技类初创企业失败的原因在于他们对于产品其实并没有真正的需求。

Dean: This is an important question. I have been investing in technology start-ups for 20 years so you learn a lot of lessons along the way, especially starting from such a young age.

The important thing to know is that the biggest reason that technology start-ups fail is that there is no genuine need for the product in the first place.

所以，你要问自己几个问题

So the questions you always have to ask yourself is;

1、现在是否存在一种非常严重的问题，而且还没有有效的解决方案？举例来讲，你自己或者家里人是否面临着类似的问题，你在其他地方是否听到路人议论这个问题并且寻求解决方案？

1、Is there a real and large scale problem for which there is no popular solution already in existence? For example, do you personally or anyone in your family have the problem? Have you read in many places about people discussing the problem and the need for a solution?

2、在内心深处，你是否相信既定方案可以解决问题？是能解决一部分还是完全解决？

2、Do you believe in your own heart that the proposed solution will reduce the pain of this problem by a large amount or perhaps even solve it completely?

3、管理团队是否有充沛的相关经验？

3、Does the management team have relevant experience?

4、Token买家和管理团队之间的激励措施是否做好连接？

4、Are the incentives aligned between token buyers and the management teams?

我认为如果你在筛选项目的时候没有符合如上的条例，那么你自己就错过了创造精彩项目的机会。

I think if you start by filtering out projects that do not fill the above criteria then you have already given yourself a far better chance of backing a great project.

（从这张图表，我们可以看到初创企业失败的头号原因就是没有真正的市场需求，且比例远高于其他原因，所以市场需求是重中之重！）

采访小结

听君一课，收获颇丰。其实，不管是投资，创业，还是为了自己的成长，听听资深专家的意见，很可能在不经意间给你一些指点哟

唐提信托项目具体信息传送门

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